What is Google Optimise and why use it?: Q+A with Olga Summerhayes

What is Google Optimise and why use it?: Q+A with Olga Summerhayes

Olga shares the ins and outs of Google Optimise

Google loves to surprise and delight. It keeps us on our toes with surprise algorithm updates and plenty of features to help improve search. One of these additions is Google Optimise which came out a couple of years ago, but honestly I don’t think many people are using.

The big questions are “What on earth is it? And how is it useful to SEO?”

Today, Olga Summerhayes is joining me to answer both these questions and provide a map to help us navigate the world of Google Optimise.

Tune in to learn:

  • What Google Optimise is, when it was created and what it’s useful for
  • How to access Google Optimise
  • Olga’s 10-step Google Optimise process
  • Different tests you can do with Google Optimise
  • Working with A/B testing
  • Setting objectives
  • Targeting with Google Optimise
  • How to locate the results
  • Can you start it up again or do you have to recreate each time?
  • Google optimise 360 vs Google Optimise
  • Olga’s top Google Optimise tips for best practice

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About Olga

About Olga Summerhayes

Olga Summerhayes is a web designer and owner of Infinite Imagination Web Design, based in Central Queensland. She is passionate about working with small businesses and helping them with their online presence. When she is not in front of the computer she spends time with her family, watching Netflix, paddleboarding or having coffee with friends.

 

 

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Transcript

Hello, my name is Kate Toon, and I’m the head chef at the Recipe for SEO Success, an online teaching hub for all things related to search engine optimization. And I love SEO, and today I’m talking with Olga Summerhaze. Hello, Olga, how are you? 

Olga Summerhaze:Hi, Kate.  

Kate Toon:It’s good to have you here. Now Olga’s got the most delicious accent, so try to focus on what she’s saying, not how she’s saying it. So Olga, let me do your bio. So Olga is a web designer and owner of Infinite Imagination Web Design based in Central Queensland Australia. She’s passionate about working with small businesses and helping them with their online presence.  

When she’s not in front of the computer, she spends her time with her family watching Netflix, paddleboarding, or having coffee with friends. I’ve recently taken up paddleboarding. It is awesome! I love it! 

Olga Summerhaze:It is awesome. 

Kate Toon:It is so relaxing, on a sunny day, to just be out there, it’s all calm. Very good. But where’s your original accent from because that’s not a Central Queensland accent, is it?  

Olga Summerhaze:No. Originally I am from Ukraine. 

Kate Toon:From the Ukraine. I love the way she says everything. She was swearing before we got on, and she even sounds good when she swears, so there we go. Anyway, let’s get stuck in, Olga. 

Now Olga and I met at several Word Camps. We’ve met a few times, and she very kindly recently came into my Digital Masterchefs group and gave us a wonderful tutorial on Google Optimize, and all of us were gobsmacked. We were so excited that this free tool exists. 

So let’s start at the beginning. Olga, what is Google Optimize? When was it created, and what’s it useful for? 

Olga Summerhaze:Well, Google Optimize is one of the Google’s destination platforms, and it gives you basically all your [inaudible 00:02:24] very quickly and easy, so that test for your website for pages. So you can just run experiments on your website to determine what content or what pages converts better with your audience, with your visitors. 

Kate Toon:We talk about A/B testing, but it actually takes it beyond that. 

Olga Summerhaze:Yes, it does. Yeah. 

Kate Toon:Lots of variables that we’re going to run through later on in the show, but basically it’s a tool from Google that lets you carry out experiments, basically, so you don’t need to get some expensive A/B testing software. You can do a heck of a lot in Google Optimize. 

Did you just say, when did it come out? 

Olga Summerhaze:So it launched as a beta, in a beta version, sometime in 2016. 

Kate Toon:Yeah. 

Olga Summerhaze:And they still keep adding to it. For example, when I was setting up tests for one of my clients months ago, or maybe it was a little bit longer than that, they only offered three tests: A/B test, multi variant, and redirect. And then like last week, when we did, with your group, there was four. 

So this last one is a personalization tracker. It’s just been added very recently.  

Kate Toon:So exciting! Now obviously people are gonna be like, I’ll Google Optimize. And the first thing they’re gonna say is it free, or do we have to pay? 

Olga Summerhaze:It is free, and the free version offers a lot of things that you can do with it. So if you are just a small- to medium-size business, I don’t think you need to invest in a paid version, but Google Optimize is a part of Google Marketing platform, which I think is called Google 360. And if you pay for additional, go to Google Optimize as a part of Google 360, you don’t have to pay for it and there is a few things that you don’t get with the free one. 

Kate Toon:But having had a look through the free one, there’s so much that you do get that I think you could play with that for a good, long time before you felt the need to migrate up to the paid one. There’s a lot in there that we’re gonna talk about. 

I’ve never heard of Google Optimize, I want to find it. I’m guessing I just type Google Optimize into Google. 

Olga Summerhaze:Yes. 

Kate Toon:And log in with my general Google Analytics or Google Search Console logins and I’ll find it. Is that right? 

Olga Summerhaze:Yeah, that’s right. So if you’ve got a Google account, you can just look into your Google Optimize for free. So you just, into Google type Google Optimize, and because Google Optimize is a part of the marketing platform, the URL that will come at the top, or it could be a second one if you’ve got someone [inaudible 00:05:00] in the search, but it will come up with Marketing Google, called something like that, and then it will say Google Optimize. 

Kate Toon:Yes. 

Olga Summerhaze:And top right is a button, start free. Push that and keep going. 

Kate Toon:I’ll include a link in the show notes on the rest of the success site for where to go. It’s always hard to talk about how to use a platform when people can’t see it, but possibly, if you’re listening to this and you do have your mobile or a screen, you can open it up and listen to it, and this will step you through the little process that you go through. 

So first of all we log in, and we accept the terms, and then the first thing you do is create something called a container. Can you explain what a container is, please? 

Olga Summerhaze:Well, a container is kind of, actually I think first you create an account, which is pretty much set as a container because you can run a few different experiments on your site. So you put all those experiments into that one container. 

However, you can have more than one container if you’ve got more than one website and you want to keep them kind of separate. So containers give you the ability of keep things in a nice way. Keeps it sorted. 

Kate Toon:Yeah, organized. We like that. So you create a container, and then you create an explainer. Am I getting that right? 

Olga Summerhaze:You create an account or container. And I think the easiest way is to call that account the same as the website you’re creating it for so that you don’t mess it up. You will have to click all the terms and conditions. 

Kate Toon:Yep. 

Olga Summerhaze:And once you’ve done that, just click next and it will create your account and which one you can, sorry. I’m trying to do it so I’m not saying something that can be wrong. Once you’ve created the container and you go in, you can start creating experiences. 

Kate Toon:Experiences! Not explainer. Experiences. I love that terminology. So it’s all about user experience. It’s saying, Look, this is the first experience we’re gonna create, and this is the next experience we’re gonna create. So I really, really like that approach to it. The other thing that you need to do is link it to Google Analytics. Isn’t that right? 

Olga Summerhaze:Yeah, that’s right. Absolutely right.  

Kate Toon:So you get a little snippet of code. And you mentioned when we did our training that you prefer the Google Analytics method rather than Google Tag Manager. So it actually generates a little bit of code for you, and in WordPress it’s pretty easy to add this in. If you’re using Divvy, it’s super easy. You head into integration, and you literally cut and paste the script into integrate, into integration area at the top of the code, and then you recommended one little extra step that we take to brand the page view line. Can you just want explain that so that it is? 

Olga Summerhaze:Yes. So when you start creating container, as everything with Google, setting up Google Optimize is very, very similar to Google Analytics, as you said. So basically once you started setting it up, Google will give you a script. Actually it’s two scripts. So the first script will be the script for your Google Optimize. And you will have to, if you are using special data, go into your website. Go into data integrations, and paste this little script in the head which is at the very top. 

And the thing is that this script is actually very similar to Google Analytics, so that is one line, very last line, that you have to take out to make sure that you don’t double and don’t screw all your Google Analytics pages. 

Kate Toon:Yeah. It will mess with your bounce rate. It will just mess everything up. I’m sure here are oodles of tutorials online that will walk you through this, but it’s actually super self-explanatory once you start working through it, isn’t it? And there’s a second snippet? 

Olga Summerhaze:So the second snippet, once you’ve pasted the first one and clicked Next, it will just spit out the second little snippet. And this one stops page from flickering. Because when you set up an A/B split test, it basically keeps showing you A page or B page. And you don’t want the same user to keep seeing two pages. You want the user that comes to your website to see one page. 

And then it puts a little cookie in the browser, so evidence of user with your page again. It’s still will bring up the same page so the user actually will not see the alternative page. 

Kate Toon:Yeah. They’ll be unaware that they are going through any kind of testing, really. 

Olga Summerhaze:Exactly. Which kind of makes sense. So this little script for flickering, that actually stops this flickering, you have to copy it. Go back to Divvy, and in the very top, put the script above the Google Optimization script. So basically you will have your flickering script at the very top first, and then you will have your optimization script. 

And then actually go to Google Analytics or Google Tag Manager set up in the integration as well. That will be third. 

Kate Toon:What I’ll do is I’ll include a little screen grab of how I did this so you can see exactly what Olga’s referring to in terms of where you put it and that little extra line of code. I’ll drop that into the show notes for this episode. 

So that’s the process, and we get to a point therefore when we can decide what types of tests we want to do, and you mentioned a few of these, but let’s go through them again and explain each one. 

What are the four different tests that we are able to do with the free version of Google Optimize? 

Olga Summerhaze:So the first test is A/B testing. And this is just a test or experience that you can set up for one page, and you can change some content or some images or something on the same one page. So you basically will be testing your original page, which will be your base. 

You will test against the page that you will do the edits to. So you can change the button, you can change the call-to-action, you can change the color, background, anything you want. And Google gives you a special Google editor tool to implement the changes on the website. So you don’t have to do it in Divvy or WordPress or with the others you are using.  

It will be actually done in the Google Optimize on your website, all these sort of changes. So basically- 

Kate Toon:I thought that was amazing. That was the thing that blew me away. I kind of thought that we were gonna, we can’t do this, we’re gonna talk about this in a minute. I thought we’d have to set up two separate pages on our website, put the URLs in, blah, blah, blah. And that leaves an option, I loved about this A/B testing is you can change the copy on your home page within Google Optimize.  

You’re not changing code. So why this is really helpful is if you’re no a developer, where you don’t know how to change that copy in the slider at the top of your page or whatever, the button copy. You don’t need to know how to do this. You can do it. It’s like a WYSIWYG. You hover a mouse over the text. Click on it. Type something different. And that becomes your B version of the thing. 

I thought that was mind-blowing. 

Olga Summerhaze:It really is. They just keep making, the stores are just so easy to use. Yeah. Absolutely. You don’t have to be very technical to actually use them. In text, when you go for the first time, you kind of augment what [inaudible 00:12:48] but once you’ve done it once and when you survive your second test, it’ll be easy-breezy. 

Kate Toon:Yeah. Easy-breezy. Exactly. I love it. So that’s A/B testing. What was the multivariate tests? 

Olga Summerhaze:So multivariate tests. The attack is similar to A/B tests, so Google will also give you the same added tool, but with multivariate tests, you can actually experiment not just with a couple of changes on the same page, but you can check how one section of the website works with another section of the website. So at the end of this experiment, instead of showing which web page variant is more effective, like in an A/B test, it will actually show you which section in combination with which section was most effective. Which means, which variant of different sections was the most effective. 

Kate Toon:That’s exciting, isn’t it? The next option is the redirect test. 

Olga Summerhaze:The redirect test is actually one of my favorites. So with the direct test, this is the one where you can test your new page design, or if you go to Sales page and you go to the current designs and you want to see which one performs better. So with this one, you actually have to create two pages on your website. You have to have your one original page, and you have to create your completely different second page. So you have Page A and Page B.  

And the redirect test, basically use it up so you can test your page A against your page B. So both pages will be presented to, whether it’s 50/50 or whatever us set it up, but the 50/50 kind of makes sense. And then you can just measure rounds of tests for Google always suggests running it for at least two weeks minimum. And then after that you will see which page performed better. Which page had more visitors, which one had low or high bounce rate, and whatever other objectives you set up. So each test for each test. You can set up your own objectives, the ones that you want to test against. 

Kate Toon:Yeah. So exciting. We’re going to talk about objectives in a little bit, but I just recently completely redesigned the Recipe for SEO Success course page, and I would have loved to kind of see what the old kind of crappy one, how it competed with my new sexy one. And you said it interestingly you did an experiment with a client recently, and you were sure that one version was going to be the better version, and then you were horrified to find that it wasn’t. Was that right? 

Olga Summerhaze:No, it wasn’t. And you know how last week in your group I had run a test on my own website? 

Kate Toon:Yes.  

Olga Summerhaze:And I just, very quickly, before they had the Canadian group, the night before I set up a new home page for my website. So I left the experience running on my site, and I checked today the results. 

Kate Toon:Oh, tell me the new one worked better. 

Olga Summerhaze:Well, no. The new one page didn’t work better, but well. I had two objectives. One objective was I was checking if the contact button was working better on one page with old design or if people looked at better on the contact button on my new design. 

And the other objective was, I think, page views. 

Kate Toon:Yes. 

Olga Summerhaze:So first one, they’re all designed one by big-time. So people click on contact button on the old page. Very more, I think it’s 90% more than on the new one. 

However, people stayed longer to look at the new pages than the old one. 

Kate Toon:Oh, interesting. 

Olga Summerhaze:It is interesting. But the Google, basically every time you run an experience, I like to go with experiment. I don’t know why. Google exams in report will actually tell you just as a general which page or what performed better. 

But then it also will give you early stuff, to break down all things for you to look and to see. How, because it’s only been a week, I couldn’t see, it didn’t show me which page overall performed better, but the bounce rate is smaller on the new design. However, people click on the contact button way more on the old design. 

Kate Toon:Well, that’s it. That’s it. It’s all an experiment, and you have to work out what you’re going to do with that data afterwards. 

Olga Summerhaze:Yeah, exactly. 

Kate Toon:100% black and white. There might be some gray areas, but then you can run another test on that. And that’s something that we talked about in the coaching call that we did. Don’t test too much at one go. Try and test one or two things with each. 

Don’t change all your copy. If you’re going to do that, do a redirect test, but maybe change the call to action button and run that test. And then choose one. And then change the header on the home page and test that. I think it’s little changes can make a big impact. Don’t you agree? 

Olga Summerhaze:Oh, yeah, absolutely. We also ran a test with a button. One button just said, Let’s Talk. And then I changed the button to say, Get in Touch. So the button Get in Touch, people click more on that one than on the Let’s Talk button.  

Kate Toon:See? I love that. I’m all about conversion copywriting. This year I’m doing a big workshops all around Australia, and hopefully the world on how to write killer sales pages. And one of the main bits of advice is you should make your call to action finish sentence, I want to. Or the other option is to use get. Get is so powerful. Get started. Get in touch. Get the thing. 

So that’s really affirming. Anyway, now we’re doing different types of tests. We’re getting carried away with how amazing the results are. 

The final test is a beta at the moment. It’s personalization. So how’s that one working? 

Olga Summerhaze:Personalization works quite different. It is with this, oh, sorry, with this experience. You can set changes on your page, and you can then target this new page with your changes to a specific group of visitors. 

It can be a single change, or you can do a few changes on the page. But the same thing is that it’s not like A/B testing. It will be, these new changes will be presented to 100% of your visitors based on what your targeting conditions are.  

So say if you set up the changes to your page, and you then one of your targeting conditions is that you want to target people in Sydney. Or you want to target people in Brisbane. You can pick whatever your targeting condition up at the list of everything that Google is suggest. Then all exchanges will be presented to that target audience 100%. And you can se a schedule of this test, so it goes around say, from this date, this time, to this date. And I mean, finish on this day, this time. 

So it’s slightly different, and what I like about this test is that if you’ve got some special offers, like if you’re an online shop, or it doesn’t have to be a shop. It could be any services, really. But if you want to check or have a special offer that you want only to offer to specific audience in specific location, then his personalization Beta test is kind of really good for that. 

Kate Toon:Fantastic. So we’ll go through the process of doing an A/B test. It’s pretty straightforward once you see it. You put your URL in. You create your variant, you edit the copy or the color or whatever. Because that’s the other thing. You can change the color of things, the bond, all that kind of stuff. So you’re just gonna have to go and play with that yourself because it’s going to be difficult to demonstrate. 

Olga Summerhaze:The only thing that you can’t do is that you can’t change the structure of the page. You can’t completely change the layout. That is a limitation, obviously. But you can change your text, you can change your button, you can change what button says, you can change the button of the color, sorry, color of the button, and then decide on the text if you want. 

Kate Toon:For example, you have an image at the top of your page, and you’re actually able to put an alternative image up behind the text as well. It’s pretty amazing. 

Olga Summerhaze:Yeah. 

Kate Toon:Let’s move on to talking about objectives. So we set up this test. What kind of objectives can we set to measure its success? 

Olga Summerhaze:Well, it does, as compared to Google Office 360, it does have a bit of a limitation. However, that limitation can be overcome by one thing. So when you said objectives, your objectives you can pick out of the list. And the list that offered your objectives, let me just click on it because I forgot what it is. 

One of the objectives on the list is where you can pick a goal you set for your website in Google Analytics. So that expands the list that you will have because you can set any goals you want for Google Analytics. And what I said [inaudible 00:22:31] will be listed in your objectives. So if you don’t like the objectives that presented in a list. I just clicked on a list, so the four objectives that Google offers us to pick from is Contact Us objective. 

So it just offers a bounce, page views, and session duration. So it’s kind of general, but still. 

Kate Toon:Bounces, page views, and session strata. So what you’re saying, just to be totally clear so people understand is, if you’ve already got Google Analytics set up, which you will have, in Google Analytics is an area where you can set up goals. Not everyone will have done this, but it’s very easy to do. 

So you can set up goals and track certain actions that people take in your site. So for example, on my copywriting school, my Kate Toon Copywriter site, the basic goal that I set up was that people would make it to the contact page. That was one goal, and that people would make it to the contact page submission confirmation page. Because then I know they’ve submitted a contact form. 

So if I were going to A/B test my home page, I might say, Well, look, one of my objectives is I want to see which one drives more people to the contact page. And that would be my objective. So that’s super-powerful to be able to pull that through, isn’t it. Obviously, if you’ve got a shopping card, you could do it based on card abandonment or loads of different things, as long as they’re set up as goals in Google Analytics. Is that right? 

Olga Summerhaze:Yeah. Absolutely. That’s absolutely right. So whatever is tracked in Google Analytics, you can then pull in to Google Optimize. 

Kate Toon:Super cool! 

Olga Summerhaze:Yeah. So you’re not just left with three objectives. You can actually add your own. 

Kate Toon:Add as many as you like! So next section that we get to in Google Optimize is targeting. Can you explain a little bit about how that works? 

Olga Summerhaze:Yeah. So with the targeting, there is one, actually you can, a couple sections. One is, it will ask you what percentage of visitors do you want to target. Do you want to target all of your users? Or do you want to run an experiment-only site on 50% of your users? 

For a sample test, if you’re just starting, it’s probably better to just leave it at a 100%. And then you’re also again big or change if you want your experiment, experience, to show the users 50/50, or you want one page to show to visitors more often than other. So you can change that 50/50 to 30/80, 30/70, or put that up. The same. I think for, if you’re just starting, 50/50 is a good simple rec. 

You will get the good and simple results that you can send, work out. And then you can also add extra rules for who you want to target. So there is a little section that says when and create rules. And in those rules we can add a few differentials from your behavior, for your geolocation so you can select technology- 

Kate Toon:I like the devices ones. You can base it on whether they’re on a mobile or a tablet or a desktop. 

Olga Summerhaze:There is quite a biggish list that’s mostly done, I think. And some of them I haven’t tested, so I can’t really comment. 

Kate Toon:But there’s so much you can do here. It’s pretty exciting. 

So we’ve started running it. I imagine we’ve got to the point, we’ve set up our A/B tests, we’ve done our objectives, we’ve done our targeting, and now it’s running. 

Now you mentioned earlier, and I think it’s important to repeat this that Google recommends giving it at least two weeks to get results. And you found that with your experiments as well because if it’s just a day, you might not have the traffic to really get a good picture of what’s happening? 

Olga Summerhaze:Yeah, that’s right. And I think for Google to kind of interpret those results. Because they’re not just, I think what they tried to do with platform is not the just give-you-results and do whatever you want with them, but I also want actually to help interpret them. And for them to interpret, they do need to have stats for at least two weeks. 

Kate Toon:And that’s it. The advice around the results is what makes them better. 

To view your results, you actually have to end your experiment or experiences. 

Olga Summerhaze:No. You can actually, you can go into report and view a report and results as experiment in progress. 

Kate Toon:Oh, okay. 

Olga Summerhaze:And I’ve only been testing my site for a week, and I already can see some results, and it will be interesting to see how much it changes and what actually Google will recommend at the end when all the two weeks and we’ll stop it. You can see results and see what’s kind of going on starting today. 

Also, when you go into reporting, it will show report in Google Optimize, but if you’re gonna look on the right-hand side, there also will be a little link that says, View Report in Google Analytics. And if you click on that link, it will take you to Google Analytics, website where this test is set up, and you will see results in Google Analytics as well. It will show you in different colors, like say if you test Page A against Page B, it will show you stats for page A in one color and page B in a different color. So you can see results very clearly. 

If you’re the person who really used Google Analytics, you will get better results writing a report in Google Analytics than in Google Optimize. 

Kate Toon:That makes sense. I think that’s amazing. There’s a lot more that you can do with Google Optimize, but it’s one of those tools that you kind of have to get in there and start playing with it. Really important thing to say is you can’t break it. You’re not going to break your site playing with Google Optimize. It’s a separate entity. It’s not going to damage anything. 

Olga Summerhaze:Yeah, that’s right. 

Kate Toon:I think some people are scared. I don’t want to touch, my web developer said I shouldn’t touch my site. Well, this is great. Because you’re actually not touching. Apart from adding those two little snippets of code, which if you want you can get your developer to do for you.  

Other than that, you’re not touching your site. You’ve got your site sitting there, with the A/B test especially. The site is sitting there and, you’re doing all this stuff in Google Optimize. You’re not messing with your site. The only one that’s slightly different is when you want to create these two separate pages. But hopefully you’re confident enough with your insight you can create your home page maybe and then create a copy of your home page with all this different stuff on, and that’s what you would use for the redirect test so you have two different pages set up. 

But, Olga, let’s finish off with some best practice tips for using Google Optimize. Some of them we’ve mentioned them before, but let’s just go through our final list. What would you say is one of the most important tips that you would like to pass on to our listeners? 

Olga Summerhaze:Well, one of them would be definitely don’t overuse it. Don’t set up so many tests that you can’t really make sense of what is what. 

Kate Toon:Yep. I think start small. I think this is something we said. Look at one button. These studies done in the U.S., where a lot more conversion copywriting happens where some brand changes the copy on one button, and they double their revenue for that particular product. So don’t underestimate the smallness of the change. You just mentioned that changing to Get in Touch made a huge difference to you. 

Olga Summerhaze:Which is gob smacking, but it is true. And I heard of those that people like to click on green buttons. So apparently if you change the color of the button to green, you will get new clicks as well. 

Kate Toon:Often, I see sites, and the call to action button is just black text on a white background, so it doesn’t really prompt the user to do anything. So experiment with your color. Maybe you’ve got an accent color you can use. Maybe you can go look at the kind of color emotion charts. Olga has just mentioned that green is positive. But maybe for your brand, orange might be the perfect color. That’s stuff you can play with. Two different versions, one with purple, one with orange. See which one works. And that could make such a big difference. 

Another tip you mentioned is the two-week thing. And then what about looking at the results? As you said, we can look at them in Google Analytics. People get very overwhelmed with results. They look in Google Analytics, they feel like they’ve done their job, but they don’t action any change. How do you stop yourself getting overwhelmed, do you think? 

Olga Summerhaze:I think one of the things is don’t test too much. So that will kind of stop you from getting overwhelmed. By the way, speaking of results, sometimes if, say, you make some little changes. We just kind of said that every little change to bottom can really generate big result.  

But sometimes it also doesn’t. And if you say those two pages kind of redrawn an A/B test exam, and you can actually get to the end of two weeks’ revenue and not test it for longer. And at the end there is also on both schedules a kind of equal. And even Google Optimize it will kind of tell you as a general result, there was not enough data to say which page was better than the other, or it will just say that both pages are kind of equal. 

So then it will be up to you whether you want to change something else on another page and run test again. Or you can just do the shared ones you want. But most of the time when read results, they are pretty clear, and plus Google [inaudible 00:32:22] try to actually help you, so it will have little things in the report that says, Oh, this page is 53% better than this page. Or this bottom outperforms this bottom by 50%. So the results are really clear. An August slump- 

Kate Toon:Is bigger. 

Olga Summerhaze:Exactly. So it will help you to decide. And the one thing is that if you tested something you really liked against the designs that you don’t really like, and it turns out the designs that you didn’t really like actually won by big time, just change it to the one that you didn’t like. 

Because numbers don’t lie, and your website is yours, but its actually written for your audience, for your visitors. And they’re clicking on the ugly button or the not-so-nice design that you didn’t like. So be it. 

Kate Toon:Yeah. I think that’s it, and I think this will be the meme for the show. Ugly designs sometimes work better, and often we don’t like hearing it. I think this is a great tool for graphic designers, copywriters, web developers, because often your client’s really pushing back on the suggestions that you’re making. I told my students in the recipe course, Gotta have a cool interaction button! It should say this. It should be this color. 

No, no, no. My designer made it gray. Light gray on a gray background, and I think it looks really pretty. I don’t care if it looks pretty. No one’s clicking on it. So using something like Google Optimize will help you back up your arguments because as Olga says, The numbers don’t lie. 

And one thing you mentioned as well which I loved is it stops you putting live things that you like, and instead you put live things that you work. That was a quote from your previous one, which I love. Because it’s true, isn’t it? 

Olga Summerhaze:Yeah, that’s right. 

Kate Toon:We’re subjective. We can’t help it. 

Olga Summerhaze:No, we can’t. And the thing that I like with Google Optimize, apart from it’s free and easy to use, is that it takes that guessing out of equation. You don’t have to guess or rely on what you think people like. Just test it, and you will see. 

Kate Toon:Love it. Takes away all subjectivity. Olga, thank you so much for coming and talking to us about Google Optimize today. Where can we find out a little bit more about you? 

Olga Summerhaze:Oh, you can go to my website, infiniteimagination.com.au. I also go a Facebook Business page and an Instagram, but I’m not there very fen. 

Kate Toon:Yeah, you’re sometimes on Instagram. I see you there. I’ll include links to all of those in the show notes. I really recommend that you checked Olga out. Super smart and explains things really well. People in my group literally were gobsmacked. You saw their reactions. They were like, Oh my God! Can’t wait to play with this. 

I’ve been doing this digital marketing for a long time, and Google Optimize really knocked my socks off. So I can’t wait to get stuck in as well. So thanks very much! 

Olga Summerhaze:Thanks, Kate, for having me. And I can’t believe I got to talk to you two weeks in a row. 

Kate Toon:I know, you lucky beast. That’s the end of this week’s show. If you have questions about Google Optimize, feel free to head to my I Love SEO group on Facebook. Olga is a member, and she’ll be able to help you out. 

I like to end the show with a shout-out to one of my lovely listeners, and this week it comes from Sarah at Content. She says, no, she says, if you’re looking for a card that will be up-to-date and keep you informed of everything you need to see SEO wise, then this is the one for you. Kate knows her stuff, and she isn’t afraid to tell you. And nor are my guests, who are all amazing.  

And thanks to you for listening. If you like the show don’t forget to leave a rating and review on iTunes or Stitcher or wherever you heard it. Your review will help others find the show, make me happy, and help others learn more about the lovely world of search engine optimization. You’ll also get a shot out.  

And don’t forget to check out the show notes for this episode at the Recipe for SEO Success.com, where you can learn more about Olga, check out the useful likes season screen grabs, and leave a comment about the show. Finally, don’t forget to tune into my other podcast, the Hot Copy podcast which I host with the lovely Belinda Weaver and the confessions of a misfit entrepreneur podcast. 

So that’s it. Until next time, happy SEO-ing.