Embracing techy SEO to get found online
Getting SEO advice is one thing, but how much of it is really doable for the average business human?
In my reality SEO episodes, I talk to real humans and get the truth about how they use SEO and digital marketing to improve their businesses.
Today I’ll be talking to a former student of the Recipe For SEO Success Course, Elisha de Jonge.
We’ll chat about how Elisha got her start in SEO, the digital marketing highs and lows, and the challenges she’s faced along the way.
Listen to the podcast
Share the love
If you like what you’re hearing on The Recipe for SEO Success Show, support the show by taking a few seconds to leave a rating and/or comment on iTunes, SoundCloud, Spotify, or Stitcher. Thanks!
And big thanks to nismat79 from the United Kingdom for their lovely review:
“Educational but also a tonne of fun to listen to!
My favourite SEO podcast by a country mile. I always learn something (Kate never lets her guests get away with jargon and empty talk) and, dare I say it, I always come away feeling excited about the prospect of getting stuck into SEO!“
Share the meme
Connect with Elisha De Jonge
Useful Resources:
About Elisha De Jonge
She started online back in 2014 in affiliate marketing, then network marketing, then went down thousands of rabbit holes to land in social media marketing and advertising. As time evolved she saw the huge importance of organic marketing in Google as the first place businesses should focus so their brand and offers stay online whether they run ads or not.
Now, Elisha is an all-round marketer who predominantly does SEO and social media for local businesses to elevate your business towards industry dominance online.
Fun fact: Elisha was once a cook on a prawn trawler in North Qld.
Transcript
Kate Toon
Getting SEO advice is one thing, but how much of it is really doable for the average business human? In my reality SEO episodes, I talk to real people and get the truth about how they use SEO and digital marketing to improve their businesses. Today I’ll be talking to a former student of the recipe for SEO Success course. Elisha de Jonge. We’ll chat about how Elisha got her start in SEO, the digital marketing highs and lows and the challenges she’s faced along the way. Hello, my name is Kate Toon. I’m the head chef at the Recipe for SEO Success, an online teaching hub for all things related to search engine optimization and Digital Marketing. And today I’m talking with Elisha, how are you going, Elisha?
Elisha de Jonge
I’m doing well. Thanks, Kate. Thanks for inviting me on.
Kate Toon
Yeah, it’s good to have you here. Now, you know, we’re gonna see that you are not your average, just regular punter when it comes to SEO, you did have some pre experience. But I think that’s interesting, as well to talk about, you know how that’s evolved. But let me explain to everybody who you are. Once upon a time, Elisha was an expat wife who saw an opportunity to make money online, so she didn’t have to return to our nine to five job when she came back to Australia. She started online back in 2014 in affiliate marketing, then network marketing, and then went down 1000s of rabbit holes to land in social media marketing and advertising. As time evolved, she saw the huge importance of organic marketing and Google as the first place businesses should focus so their brand and authors stay online, whether they run ads or not. Now Elisha is an all round marketer who predominantly does SEO and social media for local businesses to elevate their business towards industry dominance online. I love it. Fun fact. Elisha was once a cook on a prawn trawler in North Queensland. What’s that about?
Elisha de Jonge
Well, I went to the UK traveling around as a backpack as you do at 21 and then came back 18 months later, or 12 Months Later there abouts and I’m from Lake Macquarie. That’s where I grew up. And I just decided to not go back to what I was doing headed north landed in Cairns needed to get away and then some money,
Kate Toon
Prawns, prawns were the answer
Elisha de Jonge
Long story short, opportunity was there. And I’m like, Yeah, let’s do it. And so I met my husband.
Kate Toon
Wow, there you go. So you not only caught a prawn you caught a husband at the same time. Can you still eat prawns or will you put off?
Elisha de Jonge
No, I love seafood. Yeah,
Kate Toon
In February I started was it? I think it was this year, this year, February, the course- I worked in a bakers and I thought for a long time that I would never eat bread again. But of course bread is alive. And now. You know, I eat my own bodyweight in bread on a regular basis. Well, you know, from prawny beginnings to Googly ends you’ve evolved your business over the years, you know, when you came on the course, which wasn’t that long ago, I’m trying to think when it was was a year ago, maybe? Who knows, time is weird. We’ve lost track of time since COVID. But yeah, your business then was called Social domination. And now it’s called Web domination. Right?
Elisha de Jonge
Mhm, yep.
Kate Toon
So you’ve you know, you saw the opportunity to get into SEO, but talk to me about a few years back, you know, before you kind of started digging into this. When you started your SEO journey. What did you feel about SEO?
Elisha de Jonge
I felt like SEO was hard. It’s techie expensive, really advanced. You really got to like be this knowledge digital beast online. That’s what I thought I just was like, I think was a bit bamboozled bottle. Yeah, yeah. And yeah, I knew about it was keywords. That’s it.
Kate Toon
Yeah. Yeah, I think people go, they get the keywords that are maybe not the other bits. And it’s something that you know, social media does feel easier, because we’re using it every day. I mean, obviously, there’s subtleties in the different platforms. But yeah, I think a lot of people put SEO off because of that fear that it’s going to be too technical. You know, even though you’re in digital marketing, even you thought that so when you started to dig into SEO, what was some of the things you learned that surprised you?
Elisha de Jonge
Um, it was really probably the most simplest things which was headers. Here’s headlines, like, I seriously think that would have to have been one of the biggest surprises of how I can just move the online visibility needle by just having a h1 tag. Yeah, not having six of them on your homepage. You know, I think people get excited. We’ve had it and they’re like, Oh, that looks good. Because it’s nice and big. Oh, yes. We’ll go to the h1 now because it’s a little bit smaller, but they’re not doing it with purpose. They’re just doing it for what’s the word for it, to make it look good.
Kate Toon
Yeah, visual stuff. I think this is a big thing. It’s something that you know, as copywriters in all my decks, you know, we get the copy deck and whatever in the course. And I’m very prescriptive about this is a h1, this is a h2. This is a h3 both a from an SEO point of view but also from a flow, usability UX. You know, my idea with headers is you should be able to scan just the headers
Elisha de Jonge
Yep.
Kate Toon
And get a good grasp of what the pages, you know. And John Mueller has repeatedly said, you know, that, obviously, there’s an idea that Google gives more credence to the h1. But it’s not the end of the world if you have multiples, but ideally don’t in the same way that Google is always a bit like, yeah, it doesn’t matter. But it kind of does. But it doesn’t, but it does. But don’t worry about it, that kind of confusing thing. But I think it’s more the overall UX of a page and how its laid out. And as you said, often developers will choose the header type simply based on what visually looks pleasing.
Elisha de Jonge
Correct.
Kate Toon
Not whether it makes sense you’ll have a massive great bit header in the middle of the page it’s like, what?
Elisha de Jonge
Yeah.
Kate Toon
Weird isn’t it?
Elisha de Jonge
Yeah, yeah.
Kate Toon
So, content formatting was was one of the things anything else anything else that that that surprised you?
Elisha de Jonge
Yeah, I’d have to say the tech SEO, because that’s what I was really looking more for was like, how do we get more techy? There’s got to be more to this than just my, you know, SEO plugin and keywords like, what can we do? And that’s where I really enjoyed that technical side of it. Like, really? How does that search console work? That’s another probably a big one just done. And I knew it was important. And but there’s a lot of websites that aren’t in Search Console at all. So you’re a bit like, Well, Google just doesn’t even know you exist. If it can’t crawl your site, you haven’t told him, you know. So I’d have to say that. And probably the other big surprise for me was that I knew about backlinks. And I thought you needed 1000. But you actually really don’t. And then also, you know, you just need good quality ones, versus just because you’ve got them.
Kate Toon
Yeah, I remember you on the course, especially the tech stuff, like you were really into that. And I find it funny. That’s the people who are often the most frightened of the tech when they actually get to it. And they realize it’s one of the easiest bits of SEO, because it’s black and white. resizing images, making them smaller fixing schema, fixing crawl issues, it’s very like, here’s the problem, fix it move on. Whereas choosing, you know, great keyword combinations and writing what’s helpful content is so much more subjective and abstract, that people find that harder, you know, describing your business, writing your USP, people found that really hard You did, we went through it a few times, the tech stuff is like, Okay, well, it needs to be smaller. So what can I do? Okay, I can do this, this and this. I’ve done it, it’s smaller. Fantastic. So it’s actually quite enjoyable, geeky bit, the bit that you’re frightened, obvious, geeky. So obviously, you’re using SEO for your own business. And you know, you’ve kind of repositioned your brand now and your new website. How are you using it? What we’ve changed in the be made to your own sort of strategy, SEO strategy, since you learned about it? Have you made many major changes?
Elisha de Jonge
Oh I found that challenged, you challenged me on that one. For my business?
Kate Toon
Yeah.
Elisha de Jonge
Well, for my business, that’s a good question. Because I’ve not long changed my brand. I’ve had to change domain. So I’ve actually just going through a whole bit of a re Google crawl, and trying to get Google to go, Hey, this is the new business. Now, even though I’ve told it in Google Search Console, I’m finding there’s a few bumps in the road after.
Kate Toon
Takes a while, yeah, this is why we often say, you know, you got to, you got to really think about that brand name when you start because change gets a pain in the ass. At least you know how to do it properly, you know, redirecting at the DNS level, setting up your, you know, global redirects, rather than individual ones. And you need to go through and fix your Google Analytics, your Google Search Console. But it does take Google a while to cottoned on and to recall all that content and forget all the old content.
Elisha de Jonge
Yeah, yeah. Even though Google’s having a hard time at the moment with me, and that’s fine, because I know I’ll get there. Interesting enough, I’ve actually started getting local client client inquiries, which is what I was sort of struggling a bit we social domination. And I think that’s simply because of the name of social and people sort of don’t realize that you do do more and that was where the course has helped me to really like, what is my unique selling what is my brand? Who am I and who is it that I actually that target audience want to attract? And, and yes, you challenged me in that, but it’s good. And as much as you can find resistance when people challenge you, you can also have a breakthrough. So that’s what that’s how I ended up changing my name. And then I was thinking to buy go a local name and I was a little bit confused mode. But then once it all comes clear, it’s amazing how that one change can start to open a door especially locally to get more business. And people actually now know exactly what it is I do because of that name. But that’s something the course really, really helped me out with. And from there, I’m able to, you know, gain better quality clients, I’ve now got higher paying clients, which is what I really ultimately wanted and clients who just have clients that just pay me direct debit every month like that.
Kate Toon
Yeah. And I think, you know, one of the things we do in Module one of the course is that USP and people are super challenge. It’s really, actually not very pleasant to have someone look at what you’ve done and go, I don’t get it doesn’t work. I don’t like it. And obviously, I’m coming in brand new, no preconceptions. But also no, there’s no benefit to me saying it, like change your brand, don’t change brand. I’m not going to make any more money from you whether you change it or not. This is just my opinion. But it’s really difficult. I’m not sure I would enjoy that process myself. If someone’s social domination, for example, doesn’t make sense they do is restrictive. And now web domination is so much better, as you said, there’s clarity there. But when we talk about domains, we talk about relevancy availability, and memorability, domination is such a great word. But also your name is a great name. And so hopefully your personal brand will start developing as well, once you start getting that out there. I love that, Elisha, and while I’ve been brave enough to kind of make a move, because lots of people will stick with an idea just because it took a long time to make,
Elisha de Jonge
Totally.
Kate Toon
You know, like it’s very hard to move on. So you know, you’ve mentioned some of the changes there that you’ve got more clarity around your brand, you’ve got some more local people. Have you been working on your Google business page as well and adding to that? Because that would have-
Elisha de Jonge
Yeah, because I actually do a lot of in Google My Business, and even prior to the name change, it’s part of the service I offer. So yes, I’ve changed all that. Yeah, and I’ve just working through it all. And, you know, it’s one thing going other.
Kate Toon
It is, but it’s always, it’s always the hard thing as a business owner to get that balance between the work you’re doing for your clients and the work that you’re doing for yourself.
Elisha de Jonge
Yeah, yeah.
Kate Toon
But I feel like, you know, again, part of that empowerment that comes with doing the course and working together, you’re also a member of the digital marketing collective. It’s, I feel you’re showing up a lot more. Does that make sense?
Elisha de Jonge
Yeah.
Kate Toon
Like you’re more visible, you’re talking more you’re online, but you know, like, there’s a you’ve stepped This sounds so woowoo you’ve stepped into your confidence. Do you know what I mean? Do you know what I’m saying? Do you feel that too?
Elisha de Jonge
100% I’m so much more confident in what I’m doing now and what I stand for as a business. Because social media is so bloody hard, and it changes daily, weekly, monthly, oh my god. And you know, what type of training real should you do this and that I’m just you know, I love Facebook advertising. I absolutely love it. I can do that all day. However, now that I’m just more confident in this SEO side of things, I just fit and I can see how I can get people results. Like when I do audits, I’m like, man I can so like see this Yeah and look, I just this is an SEO but what I hate about social media is that people are so friggin fake.
Kate Toon
It’s so satisfying. Isn’t it great when you find, it’s awful thing to say. But the joy of auditing a site and finding so many things wrong with it. The hard bit comes when they’re like pretty great. But even that is a great service to offer. Because it’s affirmation for the business. No, you know, you’ve done what you can do here, this is not should not be your priority. The SEOs fine. So maybe focus on building your brand or writing more content? Or do you know both of them serve a purpose, but it’s, it’s actually quite glorious to be able to see the problem and know you can fix it. Yeah, and I so agree with you. And I’ve always been a big advocate of having a solid hub a solid place where people can go to, because social media is such shifting sands, as you say, change, you know, dancing on wheels, whatever. I’m doing a lot of remixes on reels at the moment, which I’m enjoying. But it feels so foolish sometimes in such a popularity contest. Whereas the website feels, it feels more grown up. I don’t know what I’m talking about. I mean, serious, steady and consistent. Yeah.
Elisha de Jonge
It’s just it’s not ingrained in me to be that way. It’s just not who I am. So that’s why I struggle with that side. But then we’ve, you know, like SEO and like a website like you can just be who you are and what it is your business really is. You don’t have to try and pretend to be someone you’re not.
Kate Toon
Well this is it, you know. As a small business owner, what do you need? Like, you know, we talked about your brand values, you know, you do what you say you’re going to do, you don’t over promise, you know you Though you may not have the pinkest sexiest balloony ish website, but you never, that’s not who you are. And I think, I think that’s a massive relief when you know that you don’t have to turn up to that party and play that game that you can actually just have solid skills.
Elisha de Jonge
Oh my god.
Kate Toon
And also, you’re getting clients under your belt, you’re getting real results for them. And that speaks for yourself. So you don’t need to dance around with balloons and confetti because actually you do what you say you’re going to do. And that I love that that ties back into that domination, you sound solid and steady. So I think you know, when people come into the course, or delve into this world, that they think that they’re coming to learn about backlinks and keywords, that’s where everyone starts. It is a bit of a personal development, confidence empowerment thing as well, to kind of really get into who you are, what your brand is what you stand for. And to stand by that regardless. It’s an evolution, isn’t it?
Elisha de Jonge
Oh, totally. And it’s the whole business approach. Really. It’s not just like, I’m going to learn SEO. Let’s be serious. No, it’s really Yeah, it is. It’s about your whole business, regardless of whether you are an agency like me, or whether you’re an ecommerce store, who sells a brand, you know, like going in and just having say, like your homepage evaluated by someone, and really what it is that you’re selling, because I not remember, there was a few confused people there about that. And it’s like, yeah, I’m actually confused what you’re actually trying to sell. So there’s that part of it, too, for the ecommerce people, which is really good. It’s not just people like me, who’s an agency.
Kate Toon
And now you’re doing that for other people. And unfortunately, it’s, as we said, at the beginning, it’s painful to have someone take a look at what you’ve built your baby and say, I don’t get it. You know, I don’t I doesn’t work. It’s really painful. But we’ve got to go through that. Forget, you know, people have come to me and said, you know, you offer so many different things. I don’t know where to start. And I’m like, right. Okay, that is a problem. That is a problem I need to fix. You know.
Elisha de Jonge
I was actually a bit surprised in the course that you had that part in it. You know, I was a bit like, but I’m here to learn SEO, my USP and I know who I am.
Kate Toon
Yeah, that first week, that first week freaks people out. And I’m glad for that.
Elisha de Jonge
But that was so my attitude, though, that really was. And I had my back up.
Kate Toon
Yeah. The thing is, I think as well, what that shows people is that SEO isn’t a checkbox to be checked is it underlies everything, because it’s about being found about being known about being trusted about sharing your expertise and your experience. And that’s bigger than just knowing how to make your site mobile responsive. It’s more of a existential crisis level question, which is why everyone has existential crisis and module one, good. You want to strip yourself back to your basic, why do you exist, and then build up from there, and sometimes we’ve gone so far down our own navel that we can’t see where we’re at. Anyway, I’m getting off on a little tangent. Now. If someone’s listening, and they are, you know, now you do offer SEO, and you build sites and you evaluate and do all kinds of things. But if someone’s listening, and they’re thinking, just give me one tip that I could implement today that would help me be better found online, what would it be?
Elisha de Jonge
I would have to say go look at your h1 and your headers on your homepage, don’t worry about all your other pages, just have a sole focus on that homepage. What h1s and h2 and h3 headlines do you have on that page? Is your h1 speaking direct to your brand and the service that you directly offer? And a good way to do that is using the SEO one meta click Chrome plugin, use that. Put your site up, drop it down, and it will show you exactly what your headlines are. In your meta description to like, how does that meta description stand out? Go and look at your competitors in Google. What are they writing? How can you be better? And that’s what I, I do it all the time for people or for myself even like what am I writing? How can I be better? How can I stand out in that meta description and headline? And just make sure that h1 is 100% who you are and what you do and who you serve.
Kate Toon
I love that every reality SEO episode someone gives a different tip and you know, often you want to start with your speed and all those techie bits and I love that you picked an on page thing you know just clarity just does your headline makes sense? Not as a keyword stuff, but is it clear what the hell you do? Or have you just wasted all your headers on things like about you know? Yeah, like testimonial, you know, like just Yes. Don’t do your headlines. If you just read your headlines on their own, would they tell a story would I be able to just read those and understand who you are, what you do, who you do it for? And why we’re better than everyone else. And of course, that title and meta because it’s the first piece of content anyone will ever read about you. will look Elisha amazing Thank you for coming in being a rarity SEO episode. Where can we find out more about you?
Elisha de Jonge
Our Instagram at web domination, Facebook at web domination, LinkedIn at web domination, YouTube at web domination and your website is www. Web domination.com. Branding.
Kate Toon
I love it. And I’m sure Google will wrap its head around that soon. Thank you so much for coming on the show.
Elisha de Jonge
Thanks for having me. much. Pleasure.
Kate Toon
So that’s the end of this week’s show. I do really enjoy the reality episodes. It’s nice to talk to people and see what impact you’re having. Yeah, that’s nice, feels rewarding. If you have a question about SEO, or would like to chat to Elisha, she’s actually in the I LOVE SEO group. She’s also in my Digital Marketing Collective group as well, you can check out her website. As you know, I like to end the show with a shout out to one of my lovely listeners. And today it’s nismat79 from the United Kingdom, my hometown, my home country even educational but also a ton of fun to listen to my favorite SEO podcast by a country mile. Always learned something Kate never lets her guests get away with jargon or empty talk. And dare I say I always come away feeling excited about the prospect of getting stuck into SEO nismat That gives me so much joy. Thank you very much. And thanks to you for listening. If you have a minute to leave review, I would be honored and blessed and grateful. You can also check out the show notes for this episode at the recipe for SEO success.com You know the drill or head to the I love Seo group on Facebook. But until next time, happy SEOing.
